Do Christians and Jews worship Allah and vice versa? Why single atheists out?

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Susan Krakowsky

M.A. in Near Eastern Languages, Ph.D. in Mass CommunicationMon

They all worship the same god? The same god told Christians to bring the world under Jesus’ command, told Muslims to bring the world under Islamic command, and told Jews they would be free and independent in Israel forever?

I hope that god has a good psychotherapist. Or maybe a god of his own to bring him into line.

And atheists worship none of the gods, but people should pretend they worship one?

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Moshe Kerr · Mon

Bunk. The Torah reject this avoda zarah of some Universal God bull shit.

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Mike Polioudakis · Tue

I am not going against you, promoting pantheism or some kind of religious fusion, and not being deliberately obtuse. I want to get a better idea of what you mean.

Do you mean that Dr. Krakowski is promoting some kind of universal God idea?

Or are you giving your own answer to the original question and saying that Christians, Muslims, and Jews don’t worship the same God because that idea goes against the idea in the Torah that there is only one God and God is that one God?

I don’t like airy fairy ideas of all religions worshiping the same God each in its own way very much either. and I try to follow the God that the Torah announced to the world, so I have some sympathy with your view.

At the same time, I think Christians, Muslims, and Jews do worship the same God, in theory. But Christians and Muslims don’t do it as I think it should best be done, and do not do it as I think the Torah would have non-Jews worship God.

I would be happy to hear your thoughts. I will not argue with you.

Thanks, Mike

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Moshe Kerr · 18h

Hi Mike

Most definitely, “they all worship the same God”. Bunk. Both Xtianity and Islam violate the 1st and 2nd Sinai commandments. Both fail to discern the difference between forbidden work/מלאכה from forbidden work/עבודה on shabbat for starters.

Xtians and Muslims never accepted the Torah revelation at Sinai. Both reject the revelation of the Oral Torah at Horev 40 after the Golden Calf. Xtianity perverts רוח הקודש into their theology creed known as Trinity rather than understand that “holy spirit” refers to the Name of HaShem and the 13 tohor attributes revealed to Moshe at Horev 40 days after the golden calf wherein Aaron translated the רוח הקודש Name unto the word אלהים/gods.

The 10 plauges judged the Gods of Egypt. To deny that the ancient Egyptians worshipped other Gods, just as did the ancient Canaanites – utterly and completely absurd. Translating the Name revealed in the 1st Sinai commandment to words like Yahweh, YHVH, Johovah, Allah or any other word, like the opening gospel of John, duplicates the sin of the Golden Calf.

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Mike Polioudakis · 6h

Hi. This exchange is kinda fun. As promised, I won’t argue with you. I don’t know enough to argue with you.

I get your points. I don’t know enough to assess them. I will think about them more. I don’t know any Hebrew.

I want more help, another comment from you. I think God did not want all peoples to be Jews, to convert to Judaism if not born to Judaism. So, what is appropriate worship behavior and other behavior for us non-Jews?

I know of the “Noahide” code. In your opinion, is that enough? Can you provide any reference materials for me where I could understand it better? If you think it is not enough, can you describe what more you think might be needed? And provide reference material?

Sorry for the bother. Thanks. Mike

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Moshe Kerr · Just now

The concept of chosen Cohen nation validates Goyim for being Goyim. Goyim like India or China or any other culture and custom perfectly acceptable to Jews. Not that we Jews have a say in other peoples’ culture and customs, we emphatically do not. Jews abhor the British imperialist arrogance ‘White man’s burden’. Personally as a born American i detest the post WWII Pax American Empire with its abhorrent world police imperialism.

The Noahide code – pie in the sky. Why did the Wilderness Generation cease doing mitzvot for 40 years? Mitzvot לשמה, the 1st Sinai commandment, only applicable to Jews conquering and ruling the land of Canaan. Mitzvot do not apply to Jews in exile. Jews do mitzvot in exile so they do not forget what mitzvot are, but exiled Jews by definition cannot and do not do mitzvot in exile.

The Torah vision: sees no Universal God nor Universal commandments applicable to all Humanity as the 7 mitzvot of Noach stupidity suggests.

In the Middle Ages Jews struggled, like as do Jews in all Ages. In America today the assimilation and intermarriage rates something like 70% of the Jewish people! Intermarriage and assimilation wherein Jews copy cat the cultures and customs practiced by Goyim societies defines the intent of the 2nd Sinai commandment: do not place other Gods before me.

In the late 12th Century an assimilated Jew by the name Moshe Maimon wrote a book of Jewish law which caused a Jewish Civil War. His halachic (Jewish law) work changed Jewish common law judicial practices which defined the culture and customs of the first and second Jewish Republics with halacha based and following the culture and customs of ancient Roman society. Ancient Rome based their laws upon Senate statute laws rather than judicial common law – the custom of Jewish society in the Davidic kingdom and the 10 Tribes of the kingdom of Israel.

Later when the Jews returned from the Babylonian exile again the courts ruled and established law rather than the king. The king anointed as messiah to fight foreign wars. In the 2nd Republic the Persian and Greek empires did not permit a Jewish king like as ruled in the period of the 1st Republic.

In the 1180s CE Maimon published his halachic work commonly known as Mishna Torah. He organized classic Talmudic common law into Roman statute law and a huge Jewish Civil War erupted. Exiled Jewry unlike the American Civil War which pitted huge armies one against the other had no Armies nor weapons to fight. Jews in exile totally and completely unarmed!

Jews fought by means of ideas and words rather than spears and swords. But like all Civil War, anarchy and chaos defined the situation of Jewish societies scattered across Europe and Asia. This Jewish Civil War, not the first Jewish Civil War in Jewish history.

In 165 BCE, prior to the imaginary fiction depicted in the Roman counterfeit new testament (written in Greek originally) by more than 1 Century, Jews in Judea fought another Civil War. Assimilated Jews then like Ben Maimon over 1000 years later fought a Civil War which the Tzeddukim sons of Aaron assimilated and embraced the cultures and customs practiced by the Greek Syrian empire. This Civil War would witness the P’rushim (the NT Greek translation for these Jewish ‘conservatives’ which after the fall of the Republc to the Romans referred to themselves as “rabbis”, the term P’rushim translates into NT Greek as Pharisees.), win over the assimilated Tzeddukim/Sadducees.

But the generations after Ben Maimon published his statute law halachic codification of Jewish common law halacha codified in the Talmud the latter day assimilated Tzeddukim prevailed and won that Civil War. Jews today do not know how to learn Jewish common law based upon the Oral Torah logic system by which Rabbi Akiva explain the intent of the revelation of the Oral Torah to Moshe at Horev. Oral Torah a completely different logic format than the logic systems developed by ancient Greek philosophy. Ben Maimon statute law embraced the logic developed by Aristotle rather than the logic developed by Rabbi Akiva’s explanation of the revelation of the Oral Torah at Horev, 40 days after the golden calf.

In 1242 the Pope and king of France intervened in the Jewish Civil War and burned all the Talmudic manuscripts (the printing press not developed till the 17th century) and about 60 years later expells all Jews from France. French T’NaCH and Talmudic scholarship the studied and learned these earlier Primary sources of Jewish law based upon common law. The destruction of the schools of Jewish French common law scholarship sealed the assimilated followers of Ben Maimon. The exact opposite of what happened as recorded by lighting the lights of Hannukah.

The B’hag, a 1st generation Sephardi Reshon scholar (950 to 1450 CE), the Rif, a 2nd generation Sephardi Reshon scholar, and the Rosh a middle to late Ashkenazi Reshon scholar, all puplished halachic codifications on the Talmud based upon common law. In similar vein the Ashkenazi French Baali Tosafot wrote common law commentaries on the Talmud.

On the assimilated side, Saʿadiah ben Yosef, perhaps the best Gaonic authority (600 – 950 CE) actively embraced and assimilated to the post Muslim invasion of Spain where Muslim published the concealed works of the ancient Greek philosophers which the Church concealed and caused thereby the Dark Ages following the ascent of Constatine to the throne in Rome in about 450.

In that same year, or there abouts, Rav Ashi and Ravina sealed the Talmud Bavli. All later scholarship commented to the Talmud but did not increase the body of law know as the Talmud. Saʿadiah ben Yosef Gaon, he like Ben Maimon, a 4th or 5th generation Reshon, openly accepted the logic formats developed by both Plato and Aristotle.

The Spanish Chief Rabbi placed Ben Maimon into harem called נידוי about 15 years after Ben Maimon died in 1205. He burned in Spain Ben Maimon’s, also known as the Rambam, books in about 1230. But like the Civil War between the two brothers Hashmonaim invited the Romans to resolve their dynastic dispute which resulted in the destruction of an independent Judean country and Herod placed upon the throne by Rome, Rabbeinu Yonah too made the identical error and asked the Vatican for permission to burn all of the Rambams’ books across Western Europe.

Rome and the king of France decided to burn the Talmud in Paris in 1242 and Rabbeinu Yonah utterly disgraced conceded total defeat before assimilated Jewry who supported Ben Maimon’s statute halachic law. All Jewish scholarship on the Talmud till today learns the Talmud as statute law rather than common law. The Talmud refers to this type of disaster as ‘descending generations’. Which means ‘domino effect’.

King Shlomo the son of David triggered a ‘descending generations domino effect when he rejected the mussar commanded by the prophet Naton to king David and prioritized building an assimilated copy of Catholic grand Cathedrals which he called ‘The Temple’ rather than prioritize ruling the kingdom through Sanhedrin common law lateral courtrooms! The last Will and Testament of Moshe the prophet, he built 3 Cities of Refuge which established the Federal small Sanhedrin Capital Crimes courtrooms of common law.

Civil Wars and ‘descending generation’ domino effect decision have defined Jewish history to this very day.

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David Sher · Mon

Ever notice people seem to hear from God what they want to hear?

I get the same problem sometimes from my students. Every once in a while I have to explain to them, I only grade their assignments not their hallucinations.

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